Charge EXR @ Level 2 Public EV Charging Stations

Rashid510

Well-known member
Forum's Sponsor
Likes
653
Location
South San Francisco, CA
#2
Usually most EV motorcycles/cars have a charger in between (for example the SM). That would then let you handshake between the EVSE and the onboard charger.

Technically some sort of "handshake box" would have to work between the EVSE and Altas.
 

VINSANITY

Well-known member
Likes
209
Location
Texas
#4
So in theory could you take an SM on board charger and wire it to plug into the Alta port and the other side to to the charging station
 
Likes
492
Location
Altoona, PA
#5
If you knew the details of the "handshake" you could probably replicate it without too much difficulty with an arduino or rasberry pi, but yes. I was exploring this while I was still commuting into DC and they have free charging stations. JE1220 or something like that. Those don't look free though...I wonder how much it would cost to charge an Alta??
 

bluefxstc

Well-known member
Likes
576
Location
Boise, ID, United States
#6
The J1772 handshake is pretty easy. You can buy the handshake module or make one yourself. The more difficult part, I think, would be getting the SM charger to work with an EXR. That would require uploading different FW and wiring in the charger. Wiring in charger from my understanding is the more difficult part, but i have never worked with Alta multitool so not sure how difficult uploading new FW is.
 

VINSANITY

Well-known member
Likes
209
Location
Texas
#7
I was thinking to get SM onboard charger but keep it external and just plug it when needed at a public charging station - would need to get the Alta specific charge plug installed on the SM charger
 

Rashid510

Well-known member
Forum's Sponsor
Likes
653
Location
South San Francisco, CA
#8
The J1772 handshake is pretty easy. You can buy the handshake module or make one yourself. The more difficult part, I think, would be getting the SM charger to work with an EXR. That would require uploading different FW and wiring in the charger. Wiring in charger from my understanding is the more difficult part, but i have never worked with Alta multitool so not sure how difficult uploading new FW is.
Its the mechanical installation that makes an SM a PITA. The wiring connectors (signal, HV power) are the same. Also the deltawing is a change as well. Its documented around here somewhere in the forums....MT will recognize the charger.

But regardless the SM charger is 1.1kW...a pretty small charger compared to the other bikes for sale. Ideally the EXR/MXRs could use some sort of mini 3-5kw charger which has one end with the standard Alta connector and one with the J1772/CCS...thats easier/faster.
 
Likes
492
Location
Altoona, PA
#9
I'm sure if someone built a handshake module/J1772 adapter for either rapid or standard chargers, they could probably sell them for a premium. I'd buy one. The standard charger will fit in a backpack, I don't know about the rapid charger. Surely not the box it comes in.
 

F451

Well-known member
Likes
519
Location
Seattle
#10
I'm sure if someone built a handshake module/J1772 adapter for either rapid or standard chargers, they could probably sell them for a premium. I'd buy one. The standard charger will fit in a backpack, I don't know about the rapid charger. Surely not the box it comes in.
Rapid charger is not that large, a lot of room in the case for the cables. Could pack down quite a bit smaller either installed on a bike somewhere or in a smaller case for backpack or on bike pack carry. Not sure how robust it is.

IMG_4444-M.jpg

IMG_4440-S.jpg
 

VINSANITY

Well-known member
Likes
209
Location
Texas
#12
Would just need an adapter to go from the Alta 4 prong 30 amp male connector to the J1772 (female?)

Any idea how this adapter would need to be wired?
 

Rashid510

Well-known member
Forum's Sponsor
Likes
653
Location
South San Francisco, CA
#13
Theres something a bit more involved than just a Off board charger and backpack with connectors. Most of the EVSEs are running higher power and also DC. You may also have to include a step down transformer to be safe and not blow up the DCCP.

Bunch of the Zero guys have used that 3.3kW Elcon which is the Alta rapid charger. A company called Diginow created a similar box/controller to work between the EVSE, charger and the bike. Morgan (owner) has transitioned now to DC fast charging on Energicas...he did express interest when I saw him at WSBK last year...
 

VINSANITY

Well-known member
Likes
209
Location
Texas
#14
Interesting - do you have a contact at Diginow you can share - would really like to see if we can find a solution that can plug into the EXR and the the public charging stations with the J1772 connector
 

bluefxstc

Well-known member
Likes
576
Location
Boise, ID, United States
#15
Tuscon EV has J1772 adapters, all you have to do is add your plug of choice. I have never used any of their stuff so don't know how well it works.

I used one of Modular Ev's adapters on my conversion and never had a problem connecting to my EVSE at home or public charging. Modular EV also has some pretty nice female J1772 plugs also.

Here is an article on the J1772 communication standard from Digi-key and here is a PDF from the US Dept of Energy on J1772.

For an Alta you don't really need to worry much about the pilot signal limiting the charging speed. We just need the EVSE to turn on and provide power. Even the rapid charger (I think it is 3.6kw) is pretty small and should self limit if you plug into a level 1 charger (120 Vac). The control pilot signal is really important if you plug a big charger to a lower current EVSE. Some of the EVSEs may only be 20-30A, but even 20A at 240Vac is 4800W so more than enough to feed a rapid charger.

From the pictures above it looks like the rapid charger may be one of these but I don't know that for sure, pictures just look similar.
 

Rashid510

Well-known member
Forum's Sponsor
Likes
653
Location
South San Francisco, CA
#17
That one might work...but its more of a stationary box. For the non on board charger bikes its going to be a trial and error. @Redwolf what you provided from Elcon is similar to the Alta rapid charger. Some terminations are different.

@VINSANITY I do have a contact at diginow, but need to explain the scope of work as his previous work got on to a kickstarter and then got messy....there new systems are much cleaner.
 

VINSANITY

Well-known member
Likes
209
Location
Texas
#18
Hi Rashid510

Basically I would like an external 240 V charger that is somewhat portable - it n Ed’s to plug directly into the Alta charge port and the other end needs to connect to the J1772 connector
 

Redwolf

My dog thinks I'm cool
Likes
1,271
Location
Brinnon, Wa.
#19
That one might work...but its more of a stationary box. For the non on board charger bikes its going to be a trial and error. @Redwolf what you provided from Elcon is similar to the Alta rapid charger. Some terminations are different.

@VINSANITY I do have a contact at diginow, but need to explain the scope of work as his previous work got on to a kickstarter and then got messy....there new systems are much cleaner.
I think you are giving me credit for someone else's contribution....